The Elite Forum
The Big Three Plus One => General Chat => Topic started by: Ngamer on December 31, 2011, 07:13:38 am
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note: this topic will double as our year-round home base for discussion of all things WW in 2012
PS - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aq5zJ_IPsa0XdGdWLW91YXkwOFVQN2NFQVN2ZnNfWlE (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aq5zJ_IPsa0XdGdWLW91YXkwOFVQN2NFQVN2ZnNfWlE)
WARNING WARNING WARNING
Last night we did a LIVE WOLFY AWARDS SHOW over Skype, with me announcing the winners and getting expert analysis and commentary from Third, DK, and Neo. It turned out quite well I thought, so if you'd rather listen to that (we go pretty indepth on some stuff and have fun recounting our Favorite Games and other things) before reading this text version, here you go:
http://ngamer.speedrunwiki.com/mafia/2011%20Elite%20Wofly%20Awards%20Show.mp3 (http://ngamer.speedrunwiki.com/mafia/2011%20Elite%20Wofly%20Awards%20Show.mp3)
Okay warnings over!
The 2011 Elite Wolfy Awards
Info for new players: Werewolf (also called "Mafia") is a fun social game that's really taken off here in the Elite ever since many of us played a live version last August in Virginia. We've also played two forum games since then, but the biggest hit has been our fast-paced "turbo" games in the Elite Chatroom; between 8 and 14 Eliters have been getting together to play two or three times a week for the last two months! We have a great time, and YOU should get involved. To do so, just drop by Chat any night, OR sign up for the new forum game that starts soon (see Come's topic).
In any case we've played 85 total games since WW became all the rage this spring, so how better to celebrate than by throwing an awards ceremony! There are 23 Eliters who played in at least 10 of those 85 games; each of them was sent a ballot and they replied back with their #1/2/3 choices for each category, which is how these awards were decided. But first let's glance at some...
Fun Stats:
* The Village defeated the Wolf menace in 53 of our 85 games in 2011, a 61% winning percentage.
The very latest complete Stats and Standings and Game Results can always be found in our Elite WW Google Docs sheet:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aq5zJ_IPsa0XdGdWLW91YXkwOFVQN2NFQVN2ZnNfWlE (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aq5zJ_IPsa0XdGdWLW91YXkwOFVQN2NFQVN2ZnNfWlE)
Final player standings for 2011
(https://forums.the-elite.net/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.upload.speedrunwiki.com%2Fimages%2Fmisc%2F2011EliteWWRanks.png&hash=1333fd1667b32efcd6010d1501dd57fdd44b7aac)
Without further ado, it's on to the awards! Everything you see in italics are real comments from our top players slash voters.
Best Player
Voters were fairly split on this, our most prestigious award. 13 different players were named, with the only consensus coming on the Top Four (each of them were named in almost half of all ballots).
5. vraal
(vraal's top five finish here is really funny, for reasons we'll get into soon!)
4. SZ
SZ is very crafty, and almost always makes the correct reads. Not the hottest at being a wolf, but probably right up there with Third as our top village players.
SZ is very clever at disguising himself, and stays UTR very well.
3. Jack
Jack is really tough to read no matter what role he plays.
#1 = Jack. Uh, is there another choice more obvious?
No Eliter has won more often than Jack, and with good reason. He's easily our #2 player in my mind.
2. Come
Why Come? Well, he actually does stuff that might help find a wolf!
Come spearheads a lot of things, and just makes it easier to see who's who, in general. Come in real life would be super intense, I think he'd out people nicely and help the village quite a bit.
1. Third
Most the time I look to kill Third just because he's too dangerous to keep around.
Third started his WW career with an impressive (though admittedly lucky) 9-0 run. Since then his win rate has plummeted to... 62%, aka he'd STILL be our best player!
Third has a knack for winning the longer he stays alive.
Congrats to Third, the Elite's 2011 Player of the Year! Come gave him a run, but Third pulled away in the end to take this pretty comfortably. Meanwhile Come stayed fairly well ahead of Jack, who maintained a decent gap between himself and SZ, who beat vraal with a little to spare... basically the whole top four was pretty well locked into these positions from the start. Now to see if Third can repeat!
Honorable Mentions:
Squall
Squall plays an incredibly interesting game of constant innocence, making quick wolf reads that he isn't afraid to change, and always investigating pretty thoroughly. His 3-0 wolf record seems a bit fortunate, but you can't wholly discredit that either.
Ngamer
Ngamer's a great wolf, and isn't bad at wolfhunting either.
Alec (?!)
Beside myself, Alec is the only other player who seems to keep dying before F3.
Worst Player
Much like Third and Come in Best, this category had two consensus favorites who soaked up a majority of the votes, not leaving much to spread around to the other choices. But let's do a top five anyways, just for kicks.
5. Gabby and vraal
Gabby really doesn't talk much in most games and it shows. Most telling: he's 0-3 as wolf and still barely over .500 if you take those out!
Yes, you read that correctly- vraal pulled off the rare feat of finishing in the Top Five for both best AND worst player of the year! And that's not all... Talk about controversial; vraal also recieved votes for Best Wolf, Worst Wolf, Favorite Player, Most Overrated, and Most Underrated. Apparently all he needs to do is moderate a couple games in 2012, so he can complete the 100% WW sweep!
4. Booth
Booth draws far too much attention to himself, votes for people for random/ridiculous reasons, and plays poorly as seer.
3. Shady
#1 = Shady. Again, is there another choice?
2. Jimbo
Jimbo has been better lately, but in general he makes simple reads that often turn out to be wrong.
Jimbo will likely be the #1 contender for next year's "Most Improved" award. Given the way he started 2011, that isn't exactly a compliment.
1. Ritch
Ritch is the worst; I don't like her couldn't-care-less-ness, and her text size is atrocious.
Of all the surprising things to happen in 2011 WWing, Ritch's 10-2 record as Villa is the most stunning.
I'm not going to pick Ritch here, only because I don't think she's had enough games. But she gets a very dishonorable mention.
Congrats to Ritch, officially 2011's Player of the Year in the OTHER direction. Shady looked to threaten in this category, but his lifetime ban resulted in most people voting Jim/Ritch instead. I'm sure Jimbo's disappointed in having to settle for the silver, but let's see if he gets his revenge later on.
Honorable Mentions
Youse
Youse is like Jimbo; tunnels on simple observations that usually don't indicate wolfiness, and refuses to budge. He has a losing record for a reason.
Maybe Youse is a victim of conditions... probably with more games played, we'd see things even out. (Which would in his case would mean more wolf loses.)
BloodE
BloodE really has a hard time hiding power roles, as his 3-8 Wolf record demonstrates. Plus he gets easily rattled.
Best Wolf
Votes weren't spread around too much in this category, largely because there was a very clear favorite for the #1 position. #2 and 3 also did pretty well for themselves; let's check these results.
5. Squall
I must say, when Squall's wolf, I don't figure it out even though he's my *spoiler*. Pretty good.
4. SZ
SZ plays very intellectually, so he'll say lots of things that make some sense, and he doesn't really have a typical "villa game" or "wolf game" that's easy to read. He's is sort of singled out by his weird style of play, leading to people suspecting him for saying things that don't jive with the rest of the crowd. I bet he'd be a top tier wolf with other groups of people (ie a record way better than 3 and 5).
3. Ngamer
Ngamer is virtually unreadable, so when he's a wolf and doesn't get nightkilled it's almost impossible for the village to rally behind a lynch. He plays in a way that doesn't draw attention to himself, whether for being too inactive or too mouthy.
Ng plays the most similar game as a wolf compared to when he's a villager.
I'm voting Ngamer as my #2, mostly for how he totally owned Neo.
*sigh* Going with Ngamer after what he did to Jimbo in that F3.
Ngamer is the weirdest person in the world. Glad that he's finally found a hobby where that's an advantage for him.
2. Come
Come usually comes off as a confused seer when he's really wolf. He's a very confusing wolf to figure out.
1. Third
Third wins this one hands down! I don't think any other wolf is nearly as feared!
Third's done more to help the Wolf win % than any other Eliter. ...with his refusal to leave peeks as seer. EPIC BURN
Third somehow wins F3s even when mechanically he probably shouldn't. He's always with two villagers who clear him for some reason that doesn't make sense.
Third's my top choice, and this should be unanimous.
Come edged out a close win versus Ng, but neither was in Third's league when it came to this category. There was no doubt he deserved this top finish in the minds of our voters, and I've got to agree with the decision!
Honorable Mentions
wheat
wheat's IRL wolf game in Virginia was the best wolfing I've ever seen, and he's pretty good at wolfing in general. I'm never sure what wheat is, a lot like Ngamer.
Jimbo (?!)
Jimbo is one of our top seer hunters.
Worst Wolf
The Gold Medal in this category was HOTLY contested, coming down to the final vote! Very few Eliters got any kind of support here due to the Top Three being a near consensus. And your winners...
3. Booth
Booth tends to play very different as a wolf, and draws far too much attention on himself.
Well, Booth is 3-12 (with multiple D1 lynches) for a reason.
I'm not wolf, don't lynch me. Fine I don't care, off to Kart. Oh there's only 30 seconds left? NOW I CARE AGAIN AND TYPE IN ALL CAPS! Honestly I'm not a wol- *DEAD* *flips wolf*
2. Ritch
Like Jimbo, Ritch is super transparent when she draws wolf.
Ritch will probably never win as wolf. She's nice, but definitely can be rattled too easy. Probably the fact she's had a up and down history with the Elite doesn't help her tilting.
Ritch has the most well deserved 0-5 in WW history.
1. Jimbo
Jimbo is one of the most transparent wolves I've ever seen. Although in recent weeks his wolf play has improved slightly, I'll admit.
Jimbo did well with his only wolf win, but 90% of the time when he's wolf, he sticks out like a sore thumb.
Congrats to Jimbo, who just managed to squeeze past Ritch here to make up for her earlier victory! Here's looking forward to many more hilarious Wolf games from these two in 2012.
Honorable Mentions
Clemens
Clemens can't hide power roles at all, although he is getting better in this area lately.
Favorite Player
This category asked "who's the most fun to play with?" And just like the saying goes, there's no accounting for taste- 17 different Eliters were named for this one! Most people were only mentioned in one or two ballots, but the 5 that stood out from the crowd were...
1. Come
1. Jimbo
1. Booth
1. Third
1. Jack
To me it just seems wrong to play WW without Jack being in there. He's also encouraged me to keep pushing to get players.
Whoa, a five way tie! All good choices here, congrats to each of them. And also to the guy who just barely missed out...
Honorable Mentions
Clemens (missed making it a six way tie by 1 point)
Clemens is a cool guy, and also a ludicrous troll who makes me laugh!
Even though Clemens tilts and gets drunk, he's a much needed variable to keep things from getting too cut and dry. Plus he always asks me to see if people are interested, so I admire the extra effort.
BloodE
BloodE is hilarious.
If BloodE is half as much fun in person as he is in WW Chat, we're going to have an incredible night together in Scotland!
Chill
Chill is pretty funny, and really nice!
Ritch
Going with Ritch here, since she'll go insane and at least I'll be entertained.
Most Overrated
I wasn't super-thrilled with the Over and Under rated categories this year, as people interpreted what was being asked differently and voting was all over the place. Especially on the Over side of things, where there was no consensus whatsoever, so take these results with a grain of salt I suppose.
3. wheat
Nice play in Virginia. But WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR ME LATELY?
2. Nate
Nate has won a couple good games as a wolf, but for the most part he dies early or misplays final 3s.
I look at Nate's record, and I take into account who he is, and it just doesn't match up. Not a bad player, but definitely not as good as his record suggests.
1. Come
Come's style too often turns into a major distraction to the village instead of wolf finding.
Congrats to Come, who nabs this highly controversial award!
Honorable Mentions
Jack
Jack isn't really a bad player, but frankly I've never been impressed with his wolfhunting.
Jack has played way too many games to not help much at times. He should be one of the top villagers nailing wolves every game.
Jones
I think everyone gives Jones a little too much credit. Though to be fair I've rarely been able to play with him so far.
Ngamer
Ngamer seems to get mislynched a ton, yet he has a pretty good record so far... He's a solid wolf, but overrated as a villager.
vraal
I often give vraal props, but this time the opposite logic is true. His record might actually be who he really is, but we choose to ignore it.
Clemens
Clemens is my top choice here for sure. How does he have 35 wins again?!
Most Underrated
This category was a LITTLE better than the last- votes were still really spread out, but this time at least we had a clear winner who dominated the field. Your top three, in order:
3. Clemens
Clemens has improved a lot; his record doesn't do justice to how good he is these days.
2. Squall
Stats suggest I should vote Squall here, but some of the F3's I've seen him in as a villa are shaky. Props for going 3-0 as a wolf though.
1. Chill
Chill plays the game simply, reading people pretty well and avoiding attention.
Chill totally plays under the radar, but normally is dead on about who is wolf.
Chill's actually a really talented WWer! But since she's a slow reader and slow typer and bad speller, she'll never get the credit she deserves.
Chill: winning percentage, enough said.
Congrats to Bonnie aka Chill on this well-earned Gold Medal! As I said, Squall and Clem did okay for themselves but this one wasn't even close. Nice to see our female WWers ranking highly in so many categories this year!
Honorable Mentions
vraal
vraal is one of the better wolves I've seen, and makes some really, really good reads sometimes. He's gotten unlucky to lose more often than not.
wheat
Even though wheat is always voted out Day 1, it's out of fear instead of unlessness. Like Third, Jack, and SZ, he really gets the short end of the stick.
Graves
Even though he hasn't played a lot of games, Graves has been village all 11 games and is useful most the time.
Alec
Don't think Alec's been alive at the end of any game.
Most Wanted
This category was asking "who do you most wish would play WW with us more often (or at all, in some cases)." And these were the best results of the year, in my opinion!
5. Woll
Woll's easy going personality would transition quite well to the WW chat, I bet.
4. Jones
Haven't seen nearly enough of Mark since Virginia!
3. Shep
We need to get Shep involved! He played pretty well in our forum game, and seems to love WW in general.
2. Infil
1. QB
Obviously QB. What is it gonna take to get him into a Chatroom, jeez...
Congrats to QB, our Most Wanted WW player! He did very well here, but Infil and Shep didn't finish too far behind. We'll have to set some special date soon where we play earlier in the day so Shep will still be awake. Though what special conditions we need to set in order to entice QB into Chat is truly the greatest mystery of all...
Best Mod
For rather obvious reasons, this category was a two horse race here in 2011. And your winner, earning the Gold on the final vote, iiiiiiiisssss
3. Come
Come: STFU IT IS NIGHT
2. Infil
Infil my dear friend!
Infil usually keeps from making mistakes.
1. DK
DK, my man!
Got to be DK. The best mod is like the best ref, you never notice them.
DK! Congrats to him, and also Infil who as I mentioned finished only the slightest bit behind.
Favorite Number of Players
This wasn't really an award- more like a survey, really. And the results were quite clear!
WINNER - 13 players
13 took this in a blowout, earning twice as many votes as 9... and no one supported 7 or 11.
In other words, everyone seems to agree that 13ers are ideal (that's where you get to add a 3rd wolf to compete against the 10 Villagers), everyone dislikes the 1 v 6 of a 7er, everyone dislikes Villa's huge advantage in a 2 v 9 11er... but if not enough players can be found, 9 is a good alternative.
Our final category this season was Favorite Game of the Year, and Third will be along shortly to pass those results on!
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HM for Most Overrated?
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nice podcast guys. I'll have to work on making the game more fun to play. Not sure how I didn't make a top player list when I've probably been nk'd by the wolves N1 or N2 as much as anyone except for Come probably. Will have to do a better job of figuring out how to convince others.
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I like how Im 2nd but didnt make a single top list! MOTHERFUCKERS!!
haha but seriously, thanks to whoever mentioned me i guess. I enjoy playing ww and i think ive gotten much better than when i started. cheers to more wolfing in 2012!
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Ha, I saw a lot of this coming but yikes.
I'm on a current 3/3 seer-hunt streak as a wolf and I feel my wolf game has significantly improved overall since we began, but it's been WEEKS since I've gotten a wolf role. Jack and I worked well together in the one game we had as a wolf pair.
I definitely suck at getting reads on people, I usually can only go by what the voting patterns are and logic says, and sometimes those are right. It's unfair to think that a lot of you can actually claim to get "reads" while playing online, versus in real life.
I look forward to (with great anticipation, actually) playing in Virginia again, because it'd be a completely different game and different people would stand out as good players (i.e. I don't see Clemens being very talkative, and now I would never shut up in the IRL games versus last year I sorta just sat there having no idea how to play very well!)
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I was the Jimbo + wolf voter b/c of his seer hunting ability. I don't think he's that bad of a wolf compared to others in the elite. Just got u/l that he got drawn it quite a bit early on.
Online vs Live. Yeah, in theory it's easier to get a tell on someone live since it's really hard to control nerves but every single eliter even online here (me too obv) does something different when they are a wolf vs a villager. That difference often just gets ignored or sometimes it just takes too long in our chat games for it to pop up then whoever's left just ignores it and claims that person is a villager for some strange reason. The biggest wolf issue live though regarding game mechanics is the lack of ability to communicate. Not like you can go "hey ngamer who do you think the seer is?"
I don't take my record or others as an indication of much value as I'm usually dead before the key moment in the game where either the wolf/villa is likely to win happens.
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Wow, what a whirlwind. I don't know if I should feel flattered or insulted by the votes. :) I guess I'll take a page out of the PR world and just say "any buzz is good buzz". To each of you as it were, thank you for thinking of me as such a good (bad) player. I really (don't) appreciate it very much. It motivates me (less) given how much you (don't) like how I play. Really. From the bottom of my heart, (thank or fuck) you!
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Ha, love these responses!
I look forward to (with great anticipation, actually) playing in Virginia again, because it'd be a completely different game and different people would stand out as good players (i.e. I don't see Clemens being very talkative, and now I would never shut up in the IRL games!)
*involuntary shudder*