The Elite Forum
The Big Three Plus One => GoldenEye 007 => Topic started by: RWG on December 30, 2013, 05:39:09 pm
-
I have edited the latest rendition of the Proof Policy. You can find it here: http://speedrunwiki.com/Elite_Proof_Policy
The most notable changes are with Sections 3 and 9.
Section 3 is unchanged from a version which circulated last year, however the version Come linked in the locked thread on this forum was an earlier version with a less updated Section 3. This details punishments for people faking videos, doing banned things, etc.
Section 9 details that you need good quality proof for any good quality time. This was written in the last version, but went unenforced. This year, we should begin enforcing this, and clearly the Monteith situation is a wakeup call. Basically you will need captured, in game audio with no delay, smooth bitrate videos in the following situations:
- any time the proof moderator or community thinks is suspicious and needs better quality
- any uncommon World Record (tied by fewer than 11 people, if you are 11th, webcam becomes acceptable)
- any personal record which beats all but 5 people (if you are 6th and 1 second slower is 7th, you need good quality)
Examples of this would be;
-- Jimbo's Caverns 00 Agent 1:37 (6th place, 1 sec slower is 7th,) the Aztec SA 1:39 ties (1 sec slower is 7th,) Aztec 00A 1:44 ties, Depot 00 Agent 0:49 ties
Examples of times not requiring "good quality" proof and where webcam would be acceptable;
-- Illu's Caverns Secret Agent 1:22 (untied 7th place,) Aztec Agent 1:31 (tied 5th but 7 people have it or better,) Depot SA 0:41 ties (tied 4th but 7 people have it or better,) Runway SA 0:23 (tied 2nd but 25+ people have it)
The line has to be drawn somewhere, and "untied 6th or better" is as good and arbitrary as any place to draw it. Everyone should strive to have quality videos, and this shouldn't be a harsh enforcement, but knowing members of this community, unfortunately it will be. It's 2014. It's time for good quality videos of good times only.
This should never be an acceptable world record in our community
And if anyone comes out with a video like this, it's better to count it as not proven, or think of it like no video exists.
-
I did some minor changes.
And I'm concerned with this subsection:
Other Proofworthy Situations
"Proof calls can take place in other instances, such as someone posting all 79 point times across the board, in an attempt to be just under the personal record quality for a proof call (the Greg Larkin rule) or someone posting all 40-50 point times across the board, in an attempt to remain in the top 50 without having ever provided a video (the Andrew Kent rule.)"
As far as I know, Andrew Kent has never been proof called, backrolled or banned. Including the rule named after him is therefore somewhat misleading since technically he has never been "caught" and punished (yet). Larkin, on the other hand, was eventually backrolled.
-
Putting my post from the PD topic here:
[...]
I think the policy could be even more strict there (i.e., label more times as significant), webcam shit is such a pain in the ass.
Also the proof call boundary of 80 points is vastly lax and outdated imo. It comes from a time when shit like Archives 57 probably was up there, but nowadays with so much movement in the top 20 and so many possible top 20 aspirants, achieving 80+ points (that is rank 18 or better) on a skill-heavy SA/00A stage is kind of a big deal. The fact that one could just put up a 70 pointer on a hard level is a slap to the face for any midskill competition. It is not an acute problem because there are no heavy-unproven people competing at the moment, but I think the policy or proof moderation should keep up with the times and cover this growing issue (growing because the rank 18 time is becoming harder and harder to tie/beat). At least 65+ would be adequate imo (except B1 18 and Runway 23).
Also the point value of a time is a very poor characteristic to judge whether it is a good time. A much better characteristic is "how many people have the same or a better time". Respectable 75pt times on complex levels (23 people) not making the proof call while stuff like Depot 26 (70 people) and Runway 23 (59 people) being up there is ridiculous.
-
Great points OHMSS, and that's what I was trying to get at with the "beats all but 5 people" deal for records requiring good quality videos. The quality of a time doesn't lie within how many points it is worth, but by how many people it outright beats.
I do agree the whole deal with 92 points, "beats all but 5 people," etc, is a bit wordy and confusing. We'll try to do some wordsmithing in there to make it more clear.
Perhaps "any time worth 80 or more points" and "any time beating all but 25 or fewer people" is a better proof call line. Axel Z set the line at 80 points when was proof moderator and it hasn't changed yet. Right now the proof moderator is Thiradell so it's up to him.
A rule can be named whatever you want, Axel Z. He should be proof called and it just hasn't gotten much traction yet. Next time he drops out of the top 50 and posts some irrel PRs, he will be proof called. Either way, that method of updating PRs is a possible thing and a possible situation where one might proof call, outside of the 80 point realm.
-
One simple doubt I have here... I don't think I'll ever arrive to that point in GE where my times need proof, even with the new rule, but I'm sure I have unpruven >65 pointer levels in Perfect Dark. If this rule applies, would my PD times be backrolled like my Duel PA 0:09? Or the rule will aply for future records only? I play to clean my PD times like I'm doing with GE lately, but I don't know how much it will cost me to repeat some of my PRs, like Inversigation SA 2:15, for example.
Also, it seems I'll have to buy a capture card, because I can reach 92 or higher in some PD levels (not many yet), and since I can't buy it now, I will probably not play more PD till I have money enough for it... A shame, because I have many goals to achieve.
-
DD, no one will backroll your times. Stop worrying ;) Yeah, buy a capture card, the sooner the better. If you happen to get really strong times in the future (90+ pointers or so) it might happen that your PRs need to be in better quality than they are atm.
I support pretty much everything OHMSS brought up. When I originally set the line at 80+ points (4½ years ago) many people thought that was too strict. Well, it's not as strict anymore. 80 points 4 years ago is like the equivalent to 65-70 these days. I guess for PD you could be a bit more lenient since the competition there is not as intense.
-
None of your times will be retroactively proofcalled, no need to worry about that.
OHMSS does make a good point; while 80 points has been the guideline threshold for awhile, it is just a guideline (otherwise we wouldn't need proof mods at all). If there's ever a time where someone wants to see something proofcalled that I don't put in the call, feel free to PM me or otherwise get a hold of me. The idea is to keep the ranks accurate, so I try to call suspicious and/or high-point times.
-
Is video like this enough for 80's?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbaMIKl7ZeA&feature=youtu.be
(Yeah it's a 90 pointer tho, but i don't think i will get a capture card so fast)
-
Missing an everdrive section (any rom loader) in this proof policy.
Also, it might seem straight forward but adding an expansion pack might be considered "console modification" and should maybe be added in as well (that its allowed)
-
That's fine for 0:26 ZAZ, but please get a capture card ASAP if you plan on playing more