Author Topic: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log  (Read 8556 times)

Alec M.

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #50 on: March 13, 2018, 11:43:35 pm »
Old news now. If the tape isn't in mine or Jonathan's hands it's gg tbh.
That topic you linked is from 2002....he's had 16 years to get his proof issues sorted.  :nesquik:

This seems very wrong.

He passed the proof call according to the standards of the day, it's not his responsibility to keep the videos forever, it's the site's responsibility.

Proof called December 2001 - https://forums.the-elite.net/index.php?topic=6370.msg102457
Confirmation by the proof mod and site updater - https://forums.the-elite.net/index.php?topic=6735.msg115505

If you're going to remove any of the times requested in the proof call that were proven to the day's standards, you'll also have to remove every time from players such as SnapDragon that don't have a currently available video as well.

I only spoke as if the linked topic was in regard to Andrew Kent/Vulpex. He has never proven a thing.  :v
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Grav

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #51 on: March 17, 2018, 08:06:09 pm »
council approved the ban of twitch links in video submissions

Selenium Webdriver

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #52 on: March 18, 2018, 03:21:25 am »
That's good -- it should be opened as an issue in GitLab so that it can be implemented as soon as possible (if it hasn't already).

flicker

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #53 on: April 12, 2018, 12:58:25 am »
council approved the decision to freeze a player's timespage after repeated proof policy violations

this will work on a regular case-by-case basis and once your account is frozen you will be required to post or send an acceptable quality video to be unfrozen

Joris Quevedo is now frozen until he posts an acceptable video to the forums/discord or sends it to a moderator/council member

Alec M.

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #54 on: April 12, 2018, 01:03:28 am »
#BESTCOUNCILDECISION2018
"Train smarter, not harder" -Mike O'Hearn
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TheFlash

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #55 on: April 12, 2018, 01:42:03 am »
council approved the decision to freeze a player's timespage after repeated proof policy violations

:-?

What needed approval? This is exactly the reason the freeze feature exists.  Gives moderators a straightforward way to prevent questionable times from appearing on the ranks without prior scrutiny.

Joris Quevedo is now frozen until he posts an acceptable video to the forums/discord or sends it to a moderator/council member

Surely moderators don't need "council approval" to freeze someone? It's up to them to either leave someone unfrozen and deal with the consequences, or freeze them and need to manually handle every time posting.  They should have the freedom to choose how they wish to handle each individual case.  The default is "trust people" so everyone gets to post their own times, but you can switch the trust off for people who seem unreliable.

flicker

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #56 on: April 12, 2018, 02:04:46 am »
I thought the primary use of the freeze feature was to stop people from going on fake time posting sprees.

I just didn't feel it was a correct action to take before a council vote because there isn't anything that informs a player his timespage could be frozen for repeated proof policy violations. The only penalty was backrolling.

In any case all it took is one vote and now the precedent is set so I have no qualms about it.

TheFlash

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #57 on: April 12, 2018, 12:06:12 pm »
Don't be afraid to use your powers, that's why we give you them!

Selenium Webdriver

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #58 on: April 12, 2018, 02:38:48 pm »
I reckon with this new policy all previously frozen accounts should be "mercy unbanned".

Grav

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #59 on: April 12, 2018, 03:33:24 pm »
There was a council vote because there was no clear guideline on when to use freezing and I think a majority of people both in the council and not would agree it is better to have a designated rule saying when you will be frozen... instead of it being at the whims of the moderator.

Grav

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #60 on: April 27, 2018, 04:53:11 pm »
Discord moderators voted unanimously (5-0) to ban Ace from Discord indefinitely. Reasons include the cumulative negativity over the last couple years and a lack of willingness/lack of caring about others to improve behavior when several people have politely asked him to do so. 

Gelonidres

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #61 on: April 28, 2018, 12:43:44 pm »
Mar 13, 2018 - Andrew Kent's times removed from the rankings

Were his LTK times intentionally left untouched or were they forgotten / not cared about? He ranks high in both GE and PD with no apparent video proof for either.

Alec M.

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #62 on: April 28, 2018, 04:49:04 pm »
Mar 13, 2018 - Andrew Kent's times removed from the rankings

Were his LTK times intentionally left untouched or were they forgotten / not cared about? He ranks high in both GE and PD with no apparent video proof for either.

Definitely forgotten. Good post! Will clear this up ASAP.

Cheers
"Train smarter, not harder" -Mike O'Hearn
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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #63 on: April 29, 2018, 11:13:22 pm »
Apr 29, 2018 - Approved mw as new PD proof mod
Apr 29, 2018 - Approved removing the "game time speedruns" section from RTA rankings

Grav

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #64 on: May 02, 2018, 09:22:01 am »
council has approved requiring videos on 60+ point times for the time to be submittable

2 key notes:

1. If you submit a time that is worse than your personal best on a level (for historical documentation reasons), the time will not be subject to video requirements.
2. If you submit a time that is worse than your personal best but on a different system, you will still have to prove the time with a video immediately. This is to prevent people claiming system records without proof.

We can definitely tweak more in the future and I suggest anyone, especially those who were against this to suggest ways in which we can try to at least partially accommodate you assuming your concerns are something that can be realistically addressed. This wont go into effect until the backend changes are all ready to roll out so you will have plenty of time to prepare for this change.

Also as a result, the monthly proof call should become far simpler for proof mods. Obviously they have to watch every video but now it is unnecessary to post who has proven their time... only who has a video with subpar quality or something of that nature. Someone who bypasses the URL requirement with a dummy link will be punished and the finer details of that will be hammered out by the council in the coming days.

Selenium Webdriver

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #65 on: May 12, 2018, 11:14:25 am »
Any problem if say I get a WR or untied and the only recording is a video of the raw gameplay + some splits on the side from an RTA category and maybe some other meme pics on the side?

Alec M.

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #66 on: May 12, 2018, 11:27:17 am »
Any problem if say I get a WR or untied and the only recording is a video of the raw gameplay + some splits on the side from an RTA category and maybe some other meme pics on the side?

No problem mate
"Train smarter, not harder" -Mike O'Hearn
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Alka Maass

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #67 on: May 27, 2018, 02:21:30 pm »

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #68 on: August 20, 2018, 02:44:29 pm »
Steven Zwartjes voted to be removed from the rankings, enactment pending

Shadow

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #69 on: August 22, 2018, 03:09:59 pm »
The log says approved removal of Steven Zwartjes August 8. Is that a typo?
« Last Edit: August 22, 2018, 03:15:11 pm by Shadow »

Alec M.

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #70 on: November 27, 2018, 10:59:23 pm »
So,

Council made the decision a while back to ban CV from the rankings due to his character. While broadly, this looks like a rash and uneducated decision, it was in fact not. It was a thought-out process. Basic human moral code/ethics can dictate that at least three subjects: incest, cannibalism, and child exploitation, are of negative impact to society at large. What creates society are a culmination of communities. The-Elite.net, while internet-based in its communications, is a community.
The council makes majority decisions. We believed that CV created a negative, even reprehensible representation of image to The-Elite.net. His association to the community was discussed; it was a poor idea to allow someone so outspoken in the harmful subject of child exploitation to be given privileges of ranking to the competitive site, and to participate in the community as a whole. He was removed completely from the rankings, banned from the Discord, and these boards.

An unfortunate mishap also occurred here with this decision. The council, for an unknown reason (assumption of laziness or forgetfulness) failed to add this decision to the publicly-viewable decision-making log. This sparked a snowballing and very unfortunate set of circumstances, causing added confusion among The-Elite community, the speedrunning community, and the widely-involved internet as a whole. RWhiteGoose had been the most noticeably outspoken about CV. That was a circumstance. Many wordings and conversations about this individual were exchanged through direct messages and voice chatting. Goose has taken a lot of heat in the aftermath of CV's removal/ousting, simply for the fact that his opinions of him were most viewable by public eye. It is reprehensible and downright irresponsible of people to weigh his (or any) political views against such harmful a thing as child exploitation. This is what's called a strawman argument. The argument is that a person is representative of a community. If such persons are to be uncharacteristic of a community and go against what most regular people find to be foundationally unattractive to societal norms, a person can and will lose their right to be ranked. This is what happened.

What has recently transpired now is that the council has a majority decision on allowing CV back onto the rabks as a provisionary basis. Our misgivings of not properly informing the public of the original removal decision was also irresponsible. He can be ranked by the name and initials of CV. His account is frozen. He can submit his times to ranking mods and administrators to continue to be ranked.

What changes in the future is dependant on how this exaggerated dumpster fire of sorts is put out. Council is still a good fundamental idea, in my opinion, and I don't say this simply because I hold a spot on it. I like to think I'm very transparent when it comes to sharing my perspective, and I hope it can be appreciated among those who read what I have to say.

Cheers folks

EDIT: I'm not against community votes. I like the council as a body because of the esteem of knowledgeable persons, high-ranking players, those of large perspective in multiple areas, and those who've shown dedication of the community. I don't disagree that some changes could be made to the roster.

...but i will be requesting the removal of my times page...

The times page will stay. Read the proof policy!
"Train smarter, not harder" -Mike O'Hearn
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TheFlash

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #71 on: November 28, 2018, 05:27:09 pm »
btw I'm resigning from the council (which I should have done earlier)

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #72 on: November 28, 2018, 08:05:25 pm »
I am resigning from the council.
*Creator of 'waiting half a sec more cutscene' on b2 agent*
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TheFlash

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #73 on: November 30, 2018, 09:49:13 am »
Idk, I guess I don't understand what the point of this thread is when the people in charge of these things don't really use it.

Found this gem on Discord, from about 2 hours ago:

Quote
[6:53 AM] Jimbo: For lurkers - Goose has been removed from council

As far as I can tell it's the actual Jimbo.

And this one, from Wednesday evening:

Quote
[6:41 PM] Jimbo: @dsx mate do you want all powers taken
[6:41 PM] Jimbo: Or just council
[6:41 PM] dsx: i mean
[6:41 PM] dsx: just council
[6:42 PM] Jimbo: dsx removed from council but retains mod/powermod

Looks pretty official to me!

Alka Maass

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #74 on: November 30, 2018, 09:57:26 am »
Goose still listed on the website as a council member, might want to fix that

TheFlash

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #75 on: November 30, 2018, 10:54:03 am »
Goose still listed on the website as a council member, might want to fix that

Yeah! Hopefully someone fixes it soon too. It is a shame that he lasted longer than three other guys. I was starting to think he was being shielded.

Alec M.

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #76 on: December 01, 2018, 12:30:42 am »
[Banned User #7]/CV has been banned and erased from The-Elite.net and all related direct communicative avenues.
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Wodahs-Reklaw

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #77 on: December 02, 2018, 10:09:59 pm »
Grav has been removed as a forums moderator (as he requested).  I have volunteered to take over the vacancies left behind.
Daniel Wodahs-Relklaw Coelho

TheFlash

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #78 on: December 02, 2018, 11:14:55 pm »
I have volunteered to take over the vacancies left behind.

Wow, thanks for stepping up! Awesome choice.

Just want to note that I'm a little surprised about where this has been shared.  Not necessarily opposed to making changes, but historically the forum moderation team has not been under the purview of the Elite Council.

Some notes:

1. Past updates to the forum moderation team have been announced by the current forum administrator in individual topics whenever those changes happen. A few examples I found with some quick searches:

https://forums.the-elite.net/index.php?topic=849.msg386117#msg386117
https://forums.the-elite.net/index.php?topic=14135.msg303962#msg303962 (this one is in CPO so isn't public)
https://forums.the-elite.net/index.php?topic=14108.msg303311#msg303311
https://forums.the-elite.net/index.php?topic=18610.msg382473#msg382473
https://forums.the-elite.net/index.php?topic=11426.msg206765#msg206765

2. Selection to the forum moderation team has typically been at the sole discretion of the forum administrator, whose job it is to pick moderators that the community trusts and can work with.  Having the direct support of the Elite Council is great but has never been a necessary condition.

3. Removal of forum moderators has typically been at the sole discretion of the forum administrator.  Removal has often happened when a moderator became less active or specifically relinquished the role.

4. It is definitely not a requirement that forum section moderators are on the Elite Council. In some ways it is better when moderators are not on the Elite Council. Elite Council members should still be subject to moderation if they make posts that are not in line with the community's values.

5. It is my belief that the forum team (Forum Administrator + Forum Moderators) operate independently from the rankings team (Elite Council + Proof Moderators + Rankings Administrator) and can make their own decisions.  Frequently we have people on both teams, but that does not need to always be the case. They should work together when possible and communicate to each other. This is similar to how the Discord team seem to be their own entity and make their own decisions.

Klewer

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #79 on: December 03, 2018, 12:09:09 am »
I think it's important it gets updated here. I'm a lurker on the boards and play often but never go near Discord.

TheGutterKing

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #80 on: December 06, 2018, 11:49:33 am »
^ I agree, I also been a lurker for years now, but never go on discord.

Wodahs-Reklaw

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Re: Proof Policy, Moderation & Council Decision Log
« Reply #81 on: December 09, 2018, 06:35:26 pm »
MW (Michael W.) has been voted in as a member of The-Elite Council.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2018, 06:55:11 pm by Wodahs-Reklaw »
Daniel Wodahs-Relklaw Coelho