Author Topic: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion  (Read 2042 times)

Jonesy

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VA 2018 MK64 Discussion
« on: June 06, 2018, 01:29:59 pm »
Play Ins (Tuesday)
8pm    Deel    GreatScott    Kyle    Ngamer
9pm    Clark    Matis    Menji    Weatherton
10pm    Mgay    Thingy    Trent    UNO

Round of 16
8pm to midnight on Wednesday
8pm to midnight on Thursday
(matchups to be determined)

Friday
8pm Semi 1
9pm Semi 2
10pm something fun
11pm Grand Finals

---

Let's talk about this year's kart tourney.

Please feel free to share feedback/thoughts/ideas.

Here's a link to the current tournament roster: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/11A8hgqy-N1-6Sr4cjYXaARNYmnX7WZYRd0ZSyAcdwnE/edit?usp=sharing
Please let me know if your current status needs to be changed.

Here's a couple thoughts I have at the moment:

- Let's keep the same format (non-SC, cup order, etc.)

- With a smaller field this year, we should probably go back to having the play-ins be a single round (less chance for a fluke and having a high-profile newcomer like Abney/MR get knocked out in a single-round playin)

- If the numbers line up we may be able to have a play-in to the play-in with 2-4 players that are less serious about competing (imagine 2017 Nash x 4). I've had a number of players express some interest but weren't completely sure if they wanted to play given their lack of experience with the game. I know Nash got a lot of hype on stream last year and we've had some pretty classic moments in  the past (e.g., Thingy vs. Steve on Toad's Turnpike). Essentially, I want to make sure that everyone attending feels included and also maybe provide a way for these fence-sitters to participate without being super-intimidated.

- Let's discuss and iron out a more robust ruleset for handling shortcuts (accidental or otherwise)

- Can we rely on having CRTs in the basement for all tournament matches? Nash you still bringing a bunch of CRTs?
« Last Edit: August 13, 2018, 01:31:27 am by Ngamer »

Walter

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2018, 11:32:44 pm »
Full name: Randy Bobandy

 :rollin:

TheFlash

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2018, 06:23:47 pm »
Since there will be less play-in this year, can we do something like:

Tuesday
Play-in (whatever amount that may be)

Wednesday
Round 1 (8pm to midnight)

Thursday
Round 2 (8pm to midnight)

Friday
Semifinals (4pm-6pm)
Finals (7pm-8pm)

I'd love to see the finals start at 7pm on Friday because that is just midnight in the UK or 1am in Germany, where we are likely to have several interested viewers.  Running the finals at 11pm is just too late for that continent to tune in live.

What do people think?

EliminatorJr

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2018, 07:03:45 pm »
Randy Bobandy isn't my real name but it works  :LOL:
No way, Mr. Lahey. I NEED a cheeseburger!

Ngamer

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2018, 07:03:56 pm »
I like that schedule.  It leaves everyone free to go boating, swimming, volleyball, leave the house for basketball/whatever, start a three hour board game, etc during the day but realize they have to be available for Kart right after dinner.  (Except for Friday, but it's down to the Elite 8 by then so not such a big deal.)
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Joshua Nash

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2018, 09:40:42 am »
I’ll be able to bring all the crts we will need :)

Ngamer

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2018, 08:47:37 pm »
I assume Trent still wants to play, and if he makes the semi-finals we swap in the #9 finisher in his place so he doesn't miss his flight on Friday aft?  If so, what if we did something like this.

Tuesday
8pm - Play In for the Play In
Thingy vs Nash vs Randy

8:15ish - 4 Player Play In
Tyler Deel vs Menji vs Uno vs Thingy/Nash/Randy winner

Wednesday
8pm to Midnight - Sweet 16 Round One

Thursday
8pm to Midnight - Sweet 16 Round Two

Friday
4pm - SemiFinals 1
5pm - Semi Finals 2

8pm - Grand Finals

Where the Sweet 16 would be
1. Abney
2. Dan B
3. Jones
4. Jake
5. Frankie
6. Nate
7. JT
8. Kyle
9. Weatherton
10. Trent
11. Brian Ray
12. Ngamer
13. Mgay
14. Matis
15. Playin #1 Finisher
16. Playin #2 Finisher
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Jonesy

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2018, 12:21:54 am »
Randy is now OUT and I just heard from Clark that he is now a potential IN.

I'm not sure I agree with your playin/autobid format. I feel like there is too much volatility in the lower seeds to force someone into a #14/#13 seed (or the shot at a #15/#16 seed). I think it would be better to give players (especially the newcomers) a chance to earn a higher R16 seed. This can be accomplished without really adding much to the overall number of rounds played (assuming 1 playin round this year instead of 2 like last year).

Right now, with Trent and without Clark  we are 19.  20 or 18 are ideal, but we can make 19 work too. Here's my proposal for each one:

20: Abney, Dan, Jones, Jake (autos), everyone else (16 players) has a playin round (4 rounds in total) for remaining 12 spots
19: Thingy vs. Nash for playin/playin > 18 players
18: Abney, Dan, Jones, Jake, Frankie, Stinson (autos), everyone else (12 players) has a playin for (3 rounds in total) for remaining 10 spots

In terms of playing each day, I was sort of hoping not to have to play an R16 round the day I arrived. If at all possible, I'd prefer to do it on Thursday, though if there's a strong objection to that I'll do it on Wednesday.

SGT RAGEQUIT

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2018, 12:24:31 am »
I'm down to play additional rounds if needed
« Last Edit: July 12, 2018, 01:05:54 am by SGT RAGEQUIT »

Ngamer

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2018, 06:59:29 pm »
Okay, then assuming no Clark, we'd be looking at something along the lines of

Tuesday
7:45ish - Play In for the Play In
Thingy vs Nash

8pm - Play In 1: JT vs Thingy* vs Ngamer vs Mgay
9pm - Play In 2: Kyle vs UNO vs Brian Ray vs Matis
10pm - Play In 3: Weatherton vs Menji vs Trent vs RageQuit

Wednesday
8pm to Midnight - Sweet 16 Round One & 1 from R2 w/ out Jones

Thursday
8pm to Midnight - Sweet 16 Round Two & Jones' R1 match

Friday
4pm - SemiFinals 1
5pm - Semi Finals 2

8pm - Grand Finals

Where the Sweet 16 would be
1. Abney
2. Dan B
3. Jones
4. Jake
5. Frankie
6. Nate
7 through 16 decided by top point earners in the 3 Play Ins

Does that look good to everyone?  (We can tweak the Play In matchups some, just asking about the general structure.)
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abney317

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2018, 03:17:37 pm »
If we could do the finals without a large break that would be nicer for the stream, although it's not a huge deal. Just better to not turn off the stream and bring it back as far as viewers go if anyone cares about that.
I know we had the GE stuff between the semi's and finals last year. Maybe we could have battle mode or something going on during the break lol

TheFlash

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2018, 03:25:07 pm »
Or move the finals up to 6pm to make it an even more favorable timeslot for Europeans.

Ngamer

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2018, 06:55:30 pm »
In the past the people in the second Semi have objected to going directly into the Finals without a break, so I was planning for us to eat inbetween rounds.  Not great for the stream though, I feel you... how about we move everything up an hour, so

3pm Semis 1
4pm Semis 2
5pm Something Fun (Battle Mode?)
6pm Grand Finals
7pm Eat Food

In other news, we have to rework the roster now that Brian has dropped out.  Our options are...

- find someone to replace him in the Play-Ins, to get us back to 18 (as laid out above).  seems tough, as I don't believe DK/Soph/Qwec have any interest in playing a full round

- turn Thingy versus RageQuit into a play in for the play in, that gets us down to 16, then we have 2 rounds of Play Ins to decide the bottom 8 seeds

- something else

Thoughts?
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Jonesy

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2018, 06:59:04 pm »
With 17 we could also do:

Top 5 Autobids

Remaining 12 do playins (3 rounds of 4p total) for 11 spots.

wheatrich

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #14 on: July 23, 2018, 11:06:52 pm »
All these playins for one spot or seeding feels so wrong but you all do whatever the **** you want.

DanBurbank

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2018, 11:20:19 pm »
Why don't we do something like an interview with each of the 4 finalists during the break between semis and finals?

Jonesy

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #16 on: July 23, 2018, 11:34:26 pm »
you all do whatever the **** you want.

Sounds good! Thanks.

Ngamer

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #17 on: July 24, 2018, 09:57:48 pm »
It's still lots of Kart, sure, but we're talking about playing two or three rounds instead the ten rounds of Play Ins from last year.  QUITE a lot of progress when you look at it that way.
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Aaronmk

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #18 on: July 24, 2018, 10:54:03 pm »
Hey I’m new to this how do we read up on the rules and how to enter? Or is it a closed tourney?


Thanks

Ngamer

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2018, 09:25:17 pm »
It's a multi day 4 player no shortcut Mario Kart 64 tournament.  It takes place near Lake Anna in Virginia (you can google Bumpass to get a distance estimate).  If you live close enough to commute you could play in the tournament, like UNO is doing.  You'd need to make it on site for Tuesday night and then if you raced well enough, Wednesday and Thursday night as well.

You'd need to commit in the next two days however, as we're currently locking down the roster and setting the matchups.
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DanBurbank

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #20 on: July 26, 2018, 01:22:50 pm »
Jones and I have discussed a policy for dealing with accidental shortcuts that I also got input from Kyle on.  The thing is, for most accidental SC's that would be possible to take, they involve going out of bounds which would otherwise involve a big time penalty on a track (so if you were shelled over a wall on TT as opposed to the one on LR, you would be out of bounds and have to wait for Lakitu to pick you up).  Because of that, and to serve as a deterrent to anyone possibly attempting to take an SC where there's a gray area about whether it was accidental or not, here is what we came up with.  Please feel free to provide feedback but let's definitely try to have as concrete a policy as we possibly can this year, even if this needs to be tinkered with.

1 Place Penalty for Accidental SC’s
- If a person takes an accidental shortcut, that person must pause immediately so that the players may discuss the situation. If that person resumes the race without pausing, that person will be assessed a 4th place finish for that race and everyone else’s totals will be adjusted upwards accordingly.  Players are responsible for knowing what constitutes a shortcut and what doesn’t - if you are unaware that you took an accidental shortcut and do not pause as a result, you will still be assessed a 4th place finish for that race.

- Generally, a penalty will be assessed in the form of having to stop exactly where you are until you are 1 place lower than you were when you took the shortcut, or until you are in last place if you were already in last place when you took the shortcut.  You must be in this position for at least 1 frame.  If you begin moving before this happens, it will result in being assessed a 4th place finish.

- During the pause and before resuming play, the other players should discuss the circumstances of the accidental shortcut.  If 2 or 3 of the other players (the ones not taking the shortcut) agree, they can decide that no penalty is assessed.  An example of this would be if someone has a seemingly insurmountable lead on a track and they are hit by a blue shell over a wall accidentally to take a shortcut.

- A countdown will be had before resuming play.  After pressing start and if a 1 place penalty was assessed, the player who took the accidental shortcut must immediately hold the B button without holding a direction on the controller until they come to a complete stop.  They must remain in that position until they have completed their penalty.

- The penalty for taking a shortcut on purpose is still an automatic 4th place finish for that race.

Boss

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #21 on: July 26, 2018, 04:33:15 pm »
What if like 2 people near each other are hit by a star on WS and both end up taking a shortcut? It's a highly unlikely scenario, but I guess both would get 0s if they didn't follow the rules?

DanBurbank

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #22 on: July 26, 2018, 10:31:51 pm »
Same rules would apply. If he hit off say 1st and 3rd they would wait for 2nd and 4th respectively.

Jonesy

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #23 on: July 29, 2018, 12:06:02 am »
I'm setting the deadline to confirm entry into the tournament as 9 PM PDT tomorrow July 29 (24 hours from this post) so that we can begin organizing the playin rounds and the rest of the brackets.

So far I have the following people listed as confirmed playing:

Andrew Weatherton
Beck Abney
Daniel Burbank
Frankie Morgan
Jake Walter
Jon Bearder
JT Styron
Kyle Begley
Mark Jones
Mike Gaydeski
Nathan Stinson
Nick Bryant
Scott Abbey
Trent Hovis
Tyler Deel
UNO
Adam Matis
GreatScott

I have the following people as expressing interest to play. If these players could please confirm their intentions to play by the deadline that would be very helpful.

AaronMK
« Last Edit: July 30, 2018, 12:50:04 pm by Jonesy »

Ngamer

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #24 on: July 29, 2018, 12:36:58 am »
You can move UNO to an "IN", he confirmed he'll be competing in a pm to me.  However I haven't heard anything back from Matis, Scott, or the other guy who posted a few days back (Aaron MK).

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UNO337FTW

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2018, 09:45:43 pm »
Yeah, I should be arriving around 2pm Tuesday. See everyone soon!

TheFlash

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Re: Virginia Meet 2018: MK64 Tournament Discussion
« Reply #26 on: July 31, 2018, 02:58:56 am »
Can someone confirm the final day/time/round schedule for the tournament so we can put it in the OP and stream information?

Ngamer

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #27 on: July 31, 2018, 05:15:26 pm »
Play Ins (tonight)
8pm    Deel    GreatScott    Kyle    Ngamer
9pm    Clark    Matis    Menji    Weatherton
10pm    Mgay    Thingy    Trent    UNO

Round of 16
8pm to midnight on Wednesday
8pm to midnight on Thursday
(matchups to be determined)

Friday
8pm Semi 1
9pm Semi 2
10pm something fun
11pm Grand Finals

EDIT - Ngamer group moved to front, Clark group will go 2nd instead.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2018, 07:54:36 pm by Ngamer »
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mattador24

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #28 on: July 31, 2018, 11:20:29 pm »
How can I be invited/join next year's MK64 VA tournament? :rollin:

Ngamer

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #29 on: August 01, 2018, 04:01:19 am »
The topic will go up on this board in February, you can post that you're interested and if there's room at the house, you may be able to stay with us for the full week.  If the house is full, we still might have a spot in the bracket but you'd need to commute in for the tourney or stay offsite (there's a campsite and hotels in the area).

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Ngamer

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #30 on: August 01, 2018, 04:26:25 pm »
I'd like to try to run this tonight

8pm - Abney Kyle Trent Matis
9pm - Jake Frankie Deel Mgay
10pm - Dan JT Weatherton UNO
11pm - Jake Nate Trent UNO

(the last one is from Round Two, replacing what would have been a Jones match)
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Jimbo

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #31 on: August 01, 2018, 08:33:31 pm »
Jimbo's official Mario Kart 64 betting lines, Round of 16:

LR: Will 3rd/4th entering lap 3 win the race?
MMF: Total mole crashes (2.5)
KTB: Total whiffed attempted shortcuts (2.5)
KD: Will the leader on lap 3 win the race?

TT: Total vehicle hits (4.5)
FS: Total Lakitu assistance (OoB, water), (1.5)
CM: Total bomb hits (3.5)
MR: Will 3rd/4th place entering lap 3 win the race?

WS: Total missed jumps (0.5)
SL: Total Lakitu assistance (1.5)
RRy: Total Lakitu assistance (2.5)
BC: Total Thwomp hits (spin/crushed), (2.5)

DKJP: Total times squash (run over, coconut) (1.5)
YV: Total missed jumps attempted (2.5)
BB: Total Lakitu assistance (3.5)
RRd: Total Chomp hits (6.5)


Jimbo's official Mario Kart 64 betting lines, Semi-Finals:

LR: Will 3rd/4th entering lap 3 win the race?
MMF: Total mole crashes (1.5)
KTB: Total whiffed attempted shortcuts (1.5)
KD: Will the leader on lap 3 win the race?

TT: Total vehicle hits (3.5)
FS: Total Lakitu assistance (OoB, water), (0.5)
CM: Total bomb hits (2.5)
MR: Will 3rd/4th place entering lap 3 win the race?

WS: Total missed jumps (0.5)
SL: Total Lakitu assistance (1.5)
RRy: Total Lakitu assistance (2.5)
BC: Total Thwomp hits (spin/crushed), (1.5)

DKJP: Total times squash (run over, coconut) (1.5)
YV: Total missed jumps attempted (1.5)
BB: Total Lakitu assistance (1.5)
RRd: Total Chomp hits (3.5)

Jimbo's official Mario Kart 64 betting lines, Grand Finals:

LR: Will 3rd/4th entering lap 3 win the race?
MMF: Total mole crashes (0.5)
KTB: Total whiffed attempted shortcuts (1.5)
KD: Will the leader on lap 3 win the race?

TT: Total vehicle hits (2.5)
FS: Total Lakitu assistance (OoB, water), (0.5)
CM: Total bomb hits (1.5)
MR: Will 3rd/4th place entering lap 3 win the race?

WS: Total missed jumps (0.5)
SL: Total Lakitu assistance (0.5)
RRy: Total Lakitu assistance (0.5)
BC: Total Thwomp hits (spin/crushed), (1.5)

DKJP: Total times squash (run over, coconut) (0.5)
YV: Total missed jumps attempted (1.5)
BB: Total Lakitu assistance (0.5)
RRd: Total Chomp hits (2.5)

GENERAL PROPS:
1. How many races will feature all 4 racers finishing the race? (4th place crosses finish line before animation begins for winner)
2. How many races will feature a player who stops racing before the finish?
3. How many double shroom steals will there be? (Rarest item in the game, baby!)
4. How many times will Jones yell at himself in the 3rd person? ("Ugh come ON Jones!" - Mark Jones)
5. How many consecutive 1st place finishes will any racer get in a round? (3.5)
6. How many 4th place finishes will the champion have this year in the Grand Finals? (2.5)
7. What will be the peak viewer count for the Grand Finals?
8. Will there be a new champion this year?
9. What character will be the champion be this year? (Peach vs Field, only 2 answers available)

Alec McDonald

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #32 on: August 01, 2018, 10:02:21 pm »
Jimbo's official Mario Kart 64 betting lines, Semi-Finals:

LR: Will 3rd/4th entering lap 3 win the race? - NO
MMF: Total mole crashes (1.5) - OVER
KTB: Total whiffed attempted shortcuts (1.5) - OVER
KD: Will the leader on lap 3 win the race? - NO

TT: Total vehicle hits (3.5) - OVER
FS: Total Lakitu assistance (OoB, water), (0.5) - OVER
CM: Total bomb hits (2.5) - UNDER
MR: Will 3rd/4th place entering lap 3 win the race? - YES

WS: Total missed jumps (0.5) - OVER
SL: Total Lakitu assistance (1.5) - UNDER
RRy: Total Lakitu assistance (2.5) - UNDER
BC: Total Thwomp hits (spin/crushed), (1.5) - UNDER

DKJP: Total times squash (run over, coconut) (1.5) - UNDER
YV: Total missed jumps attempted (1.5) - OVER
BB: Total Lakitu assistance (1.5) - OVER
RRd: Total Chomp hits (3.5) - UNDER

GENERAL PROPS (Semi-Finals!):
1. How many races will feature all 4 racers finishing the race? (4th place crosses finish line before animation begins for winner) - THREE
2. How many races will feature a player who stops racing before the finish? - TWO
3. How many double shroom steals will there be? (Rarest item in the game, baby!) - ZERO, BABY!
4. How many times will Jones yell at himself in the 3rd person? ("Ugh come ON Jones!" - Mark Jones) - (betting Jones plays in Semis obv) - ONCE
5. How many consecutive 1st place finishes will any racer get in a round? (3.5) - UNDER
"Train smarter, not harder" -Mike O'Hearn
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Ngamer

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #33 on: August 02, 2018, 02:54:58 am »
Plan for Thursday

8pm - Abney JT Deel Ngamer
9pm - Dan Kyle Clark Mgay
10pm - Jones Frankie Weatherton Matis
11pm - Jones Nate Clark Ngamer

EDIT - Adjusted to get some oldsters to bed earlier.
« Last Edit: August 02, 2018, 02:16:09 pm by Ngamer »
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Ngamer

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #34 on: August 02, 2018, 07:56:29 pm »
SWITCHUP, Trent is going to be in the Semis and he needs to drive out of here at 7pm tomorrow, so the new schedule will be

3pm - SemiFinal #1
4pm - SemiFinal #2
5pm - Something Fun
6pm - Grand Finals

Good news for Europe!
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Rützou

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #35 on: August 03, 2018, 02:54:59 pm »
SWITCHUP, Trent is going to be in the Semis and he needs to drive out of here at 7pm tomorrow, so the new schedule will be

3pm - SemiFinal #1
4pm - SemiFinal #2
5pm - Something Fun
6pm - Grand Finals

Good news for Europe!

Fuck yeah!!

NathanStinson

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #36 on: August 05, 2018, 02:19:56 pm »
Wish I had seen the props earlier, and I would have for sure filled one out
Keeper of Jimbo's Pillow

Boss

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #37 on: August 08, 2018, 06:31:07 pm »
I know VA is over, but I have been pondering a new format for the last few days to introduce in 2019. Playins I haven't been able to think of anything that is a slam dunk yet especially if we approach around 24-26 people again like in 2017. The seeds are just for hypothetical and will not reflect actual results, just the most likely ones in theory. This is my idea for R16 and after:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U2n7oEwM9zlgfYAhTh5rRe92OmUlmFigaBsg8AJk4MY/edit?usp=sharing

TheFlash

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #38 on: August 08, 2018, 11:20:38 pm »
I know VA is over, but I have been pondering a new format for the last few days to introduce in 2019. Playins I haven't been able to think of anything that is a slam dunk yet especially if we approach around 24-26 people again like in 2017. The seeds are just for hypothetical and will not reflect actual results, just the most likely ones in theory. This is my idea for R16 and after:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U2n7oEwM9zlgfYAhTh5rRe92OmUlmFigaBsg8AJk4MY/edit?usp=sharing

Indeed, I suggested a "must win to advance" scheme when brainstorming ideas with Jones a while back.

Compared to playing just 2 rounds in the round of 16 players, it certainly has some advantages.  The idea that a win is what gets you to the next round is very appealing.  One of the best features is it protects better against the effects of unbalanced rounds when there is a single player who will only score 0-5 points and whoever gets to play with them gets a free boost across rounds.  It is very satisfying that everyone in the top 8 has gotten 1st place in a match to get to that round.

This format can also be extended depending on the exact number of players, completely skipping the need to trim the field down to a top 16. Everyone who enters can be placed directly into a match with certain high performers getting a bye in the earliest stages if needed.

Some tweaks can be made to get rid of the need for non-4p tiebreaker situations. The general idea does have merit, though.

Alternatively, we could have 4 complete setups around the house and have all 16 players playing at once for a 4 hour period to complete 4 full rounds in the round of 16.  A guy can dream....

jtmoney

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #39 on: August 08, 2018, 11:40:28 pm »
Idk how it was after I went on hiatus for a few years, but the first couple years in 07 and 08 we played a lot more Kart than now. And we had multiple setups. If I'm not mistaken, at least 3 setups for 4p if not 4 setups. I know I remember playing upstairs and in the basement during the week for official rounds.

no_control

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #40 on: August 09, 2018, 05:02:16 pm »
I know VA is over, but I have been pondering a new format for the last few days to introduce in 2019. Playins I haven't been able to think of anything that is a slam dunk yet especially if we approach around 24-26 people again like in 2017. The seeds are just for hypothetical and will not reflect actual results, just the most likely ones in theory. This is my idea for R16 and after:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U2n7oEwM9zlgfYAhTh5rRe92OmUlmFigaBsg8AJk4MY/edit?usp=sharing

Like the idea very much. I would do the next things differently since i'm not a fan of those random 1-3 track deciders:

R8 seed 11-13 is determined simply by who got the most points among 3rd place finishers in R5-R7

Finals seed 3 is simply the person with more points between 2nd place finishers in S1 and S2 (simple option)
or
S3 is a match between seed 3-6 --> winner goes to the finals
S4 is 3 losers from S3 and person with more points between 4th place finishers in S1 and S2 (interesting option since you literally fight for every point in S1 and S2 since better 2nd goes directly through, and others get 1 more chance then players finished in last)
« Last Edit: August 09, 2018, 05:09:59 pm by no_control »

kyleb30

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #41 on: August 12, 2018, 07:44:28 pm »
I like the idea of making some tweaks to the format, the proposal Boss put out looks intriguing. I was actually discussing this with abney when i was driving him to the airport after the meet, here is the general guidelines. For the purposes of this, I ignored the playins as those change every year based on participation.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1maj27siKuy_6VtvjTsyRbb3m9wGMgssmTA8N1qVEOEI/edit?usp=sharing

Some notes about the format:
- Same number of total rounds from the current format, 1 less R16 and 1 more Semi
- Advancements are pretty straight forward (you know you're advancing with 1st, know your eliminated with 4th)
- Promotes winning to advance rather than playing for 2nd. On that note, I believe you're less likely to get a player to give up.

- The biggest downside is that it's possible for people to go 1 and done. One bad round kills you.
- Not necessarily "have to win to advance" style, but it's very close. Only time a 2nd place advances to the next round is if it's the final match of the round.

Let me know what you guys think, I have a few other possible proposals if people are interested in hearing more ideas!

Ngamer

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion | Matches start 8pm every night
« Reply #42 on: August 13, 2018, 01:31:01 am »
I like the Kyle/Abney proposal, it's nice and clean and ensures constant drama over both 1st and 3rd place for every round.  Except for R7 and S3, but there's lots 'o drama over 2nd place in those so it's still cool.  The only downsides I see are

- we'll need to build out two time-killers for the stream on Friday so we don't lose viewership (we'll need an extra gap as people don't want to immediately play again)
- there's going to be lots more ties since the difference between 1st/2nd and 3rd/4th is always such a big deal.  that's fine though, they'll be exciting to watch, and we're cutting an hour from the schedule on Thursday so there's plenty of time to fit them in

I'm not interested in increasing the total number of rounds and/or going back to playing official matches elsewhere in the house, would prefer keeping everything to 4 hour blocks on stream using the ideal setup downstairs.
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SGT RAGEQUIT

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion
« Reply #43 on: August 13, 2018, 12:02:34 pm »
Make the 4 losers from the semis play Goldeneye multi in the gap before the finals

NathanStinson

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion
« Reply #44 on: August 14, 2018, 09:53:43 am »
Make the 4 losers from the semis play Goldeneye multi in the gap before the finals
I would get behind this for the laughs.... but Jimbo would slaughter everyone :-p
Keeper of Jimbo's Pillow

jtmoney

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion
« Reply #45 on: August 15, 2018, 02:33:36 am »
Stin, you are making a huge assumption that Jimbo even comes back....or even makes it to the semis  :v

wheatrich

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion
« Reply #46 on: August 16, 2018, 01:27:11 am »
Both of those proposals are close to what I proposed and got laughed at/called dumb for eons ago by many of the same people not doing that right now.  Some things never change.

Biggest positives are more intense winner take all for the 8 seed (unless you are in it) two biggest negatives are added rage due to unlucky bracket and possible screwing over from someone already eliminated.  (this was a small potential before due to not playing at the same time, here that latter part doesn't matter but still not impossible)  [and there's been a bunch of early rounds come down to a point or two at the top which completely changes the last race]

Beck didn't win his opening match this year; you never know with these things.

Boss

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Re: VA 2018 MK64 Discussion
« Reply #47 on: August 19, 2018, 09:25:06 pm »
I updated my proposal so there are no more forced tiebreaker matches. I think I mostly did the changes Zoki suggested. There are 2 main difference between this proposal and the Kyle/Abney

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U2n7oEwM9zlgfYAhTh5rRe92OmUlmFigaBsg8AJk4MY/edit?usp=sharing

1. Everyone will get at least 2 chances in the R16 to advance. With a potentially stacked field next year, this is a nice format in case seeding wasn't accurate and some players draw brutal matches in their first R16 match. There is an additional R8 match winner takes all instead of advancing 1st and 2nd in the final R16 match.
2. Higher scoring 2nd place will claim seed 3 for finals instead of needing to play again in S3 match. S3 will then be a winner take all instead of 1st and 2nd both advancing as only seed 4 is on the line.