Author Topic: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.  (Read 124923 times)

flukey lukey

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1800 on: October 21, 2014, 10:22:41 pm »
Awesome completion Kyle! go for untied
LAS

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flicker

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1801 on: October 23, 2014, 12:49:02 am »
Streets DLTK 5:52
raw vid: http://youtu.be/Bt34gM49dbM
music vid:

Quote from: Flickerform
Shoutous to Silentf0e, who held the previous record of 6:05 and invented the "glass tank" strategy used for stopping the spawn guards on the level.

Thanks to Icy, and Adam Bozon who came up with some safer, more consistent, and even time saving strategies that helped me get this time.

SUB 6 BABY

Icy

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1802 on: October 23, 2014, 12:52:10 am »
Incredible job! It's awesome to see the new Body Armor strat with the KF7 dash pulled off! That record is going to stand for a long time on just the raw luck needed alone! Congrats!

Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1803 on: October 23, 2014, 12:54:57 am »
Congrats buddy! You deserve it!  :pimp: :pimp: :pimp:

Aztec Exemplar

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1804 on: October 23, 2014, 01:12:52 am »
Holy shit sick sub 6

Congrats man!
"Time's a teacher spitting since I was tying sneakers" - Jus

flukey lukey

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1805 on: October 23, 2014, 03:37:53 am »
DUDE!!

when I saw this it made me say "Yes" out loud. dude that's really fucking sick. didn't even take you too long. what are your thoughts on max/potential WR in the future .. can't wait to watch this one when I get home.
LAS

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AZ

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1806 on: October 23, 2014, 03:43:22 am »
Very nice Kyle! Great untied

flicker

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1807 on: October 23, 2014, 04:14:18 am »
what are your thoughts on max/potential WR in the future

my first half (up to val) was pretty average. the intro nade was pretty late and the house guard kill was quite sloppy. give or take 20 seconds to save there on a perfect run.
the latter half of the run was amazing, i survived the spawn guard at the tank with enough health to take a hit, which is ideal. guard RNG everywhere was perfect really, this can screw you so much.

you can have two setups for the random guards in the 2nd half that will allow really fast times

(in order they appear)
rockets / KF7 / KF7 / rockets (seen in 6:05)
KF7 / rockets / KF7 / rockets (what I got)

getting the KF7 guards first just saves the time it would take to do the mortar shots the at next set. the chances of getting across and surviving are very slim. you will always take at least one hit, and i was lucky enough to survive here. i picked up the body armor, but it was only for explosive safety, it wasnt enough to allow me another hit from a KF7. when the next guards had KF7s, there is still a good chance to be shot, but i was again lucky to live here and continue running past the rocket guards.

with some insane optimization i could realistically see something around 5:30 with current strats

Edit: if you want to see a comparison between my video and the past record of 6:05, click here
« Last Edit: October 23, 2014, 09:21:17 pm by entity of light »

flicker

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1808 on: October 27, 2014, 03:28:22 am »
Holy fuck...

Streets DLTK 5:26


this is the luckiest run i have ever had. i have never had a faster intro, and my pace to val was insane.

you will always take at least one hit, and i was lucky enough to survive here.

eating my words here... but really, this is just unheard of. cant believe what happened in my run.

Icy

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1809 on: October 27, 2014, 03:37:22 am »
WHAT THE FUCK

TAS-like intro, perfect guard setups, ZERO HITS RUNNING ACROSS THE GUARDS...

WOW

Aztec Exemplar

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1810 on: October 27, 2014, 03:48:42 am »
Flicker is DLTK god
"Time's a teacher spitting since I was tying sneakers" - Jus

Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1811 on: October 27, 2014, 03:49:24 am »


Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1813 on: October 27, 2014, 06:50:44 am »
Siiiiick run. Amazing job!

Troublesome Moral Code

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1814 on: October 27, 2014, 07:24:56 am »
Quoting is for fools. Don't you have your own thoughts to share?

Amazing run Flicker  :o You sure made that look easy... The grenade luck at the start was absolutely insane. Professional execution all around, as well. It'll be fun to see how long this lasts untied :pimp:
Live life on 00 Agent.

AZ

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1815 on: October 27, 2014, 07:40:10 am »
Quoting is for fools. Don't you have your own thoughts to share?

I do, now that I've watched the run.

I think this is a very strong untied. Sure it's a bit of luck involved, but that applies to most DLTK levels. Looks like you hit the jackpot on most parts (insane start). I agree with Michael: your runs make the stage look easy and I'm now very tempted to go for a completion myself.

Superb job Kyle!

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1816 on: October 27, 2014, 12:34:26 pm »
Strat idea:

1. Do beginning like normal (pick up plenty of KF7 ammo).
2. Drive the tank onto the street and immediately get out and run past the T-junction to make both spawn guards appear.
3. Now head over to Valentin's alley exit and show yourself to the guard there.
4. Quickly run into the corner near the white car, and shoot a bunch of KF7 bullets (not sure how many you need).
5. Head back to the tank, and clear out the remaining 3 guards at the beginning of Val's alley (at the normal SA/00A entrance).
6. Do the thing with the tank to get the spawn guards stuck. (You shouldn' have to wait that long for them to appear).
7. Head over to Valentin, hug the right wall right before the entrance to avoid getting killed by the window guard, then quickly run past the street and into Val's house.
8. After Val, run past the street again, and kill the window guard (don't shoot too quickly, or you might alert the 4 remaining guards you lured earlier).
9. Get GL/BA, and kill the 4 guards in the corner by the white car with the GL.



Not sure how much time this saves but sub 5 min shouldn't be a problem with a good run.

Edit: Apparently the window guard can be frozen just like crate guards (where they aim but never shoot). So it might be possible to skip killing him completely. He should be much easier to manipulate than most crate guards though because of his position and how close you can get without him being able to shoot you.

Edit2: Lol it seems to be super easy and consistent to freeze the window guard. Just look through the non-walkthrough window until he aims at you. Then run in. Simple as that. (i think this glitch is NTSC only but haven't confirmed this yet). As long as he doesn't kneel, he'll freeze.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2014, 01:26:53 pm by Wyst3r »

Deep-Darkness

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1817 on: October 27, 2014, 02:26:02 pm »
Congrats on that sick untied, Kyle!

Amazing job, Henrik! I hope sub 4 happens soon!
Let A be a pizza of radius z and height a. Its volume is V_A = pi·(z^2)·a = pizza.

Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1818 on: October 27, 2014, 03:51:48 pm »

flukey lukey

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1819 on: October 27, 2014, 05:09:15 pm »
great job Flick and nice finds henrik, good stuff
LAS

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Icy

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1820 on: October 27, 2014, 10:24:30 pm »
Nice idea, Henrik! That'll definitely save a good chunk of time!

Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1821 on: October 28, 2014, 10:53:05 am »
Tested this a bit on PAL today and the freeze glitch was indeed fixed there. So i guess NTSC has a bit of an advantage when it comes to DLTK and levels with stationary guards.

Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1822 on: October 29, 2014, 01:17:20 pm »
I realized yesterday after watching Bozon's Streets DLTK tutorial that alot of the things we do when setting up the tank strat are unnecessary. For example, all you need to do to get a spawn guard stuck is this:


The trick is to have the guards register Bond's last known position as being on top of the tank. In this case, i was able to do it by being on top of it at the moment a guard spawned. Any additional stuff such as making sure the tank is covering the entire pathway and stuff like that is useless. Strafing into the wall after letting the guards see you also serves no purpose and is actually a bad thing, since if there's even a tiny gap between the tank and the wall, the guards might be able to reach it. You're better off just standing in the middle of the tank for a few seconds.

Since we need the guards to be stuck in Val's alleyway and not in the middle of the street, we can't set their last known position at the moment they spawn (because then we'd be too far away, and they wouldn't spawn at all). So the next best thing would be to use the second time they read Bond's position, i.e. the moment they reach the previous known position. The strat then would be something like:

1. Make the guards spawn.
2. Lure the guards into the corner by the white car (my strat).
3. Drive into the alley with the tank and kill the 3 guards there, then just wait while on top of it. (no need to get it into position or anything)
4. Wait until the guards reach your last known position (which will be somewhere near the T-junction), then run to Val.


This way, the guards will head for the tank and get stuck in the alley without them ever having seen you. As mentioned previously, the tank doesn't need any special positioning, so you can just kill the first few guards there and then wait at whatever spot you ended up in.

The only problem with this is that I don't really know how long you need to wait. It will depend on a number of factors, such as where you were when the guards spawned and when they spawned. The latter is easy to know though, since there's an on-screen timer. In the video above, you might've noticed the "Pursue Ouromov and Natalya" and "Minimize civilian casualties" messages popping up. I modded the scripts to show these messages when each guard attempts to spawn. In order to know when guards spawn in an unmodded game, you need to check the on-screen timer:

Guard #1      Guard #2     Civilian #1     Civilian #2
02:44:99
02:43:99
02:41:99
02:40:99
02:39:99
02:37:99
02:34:99
02:33:99
02:31:9902:31:99
02:29:99
02:25:9902:25:99
02:24:99
02:22:99
02:19:9902:19:99
02:17:99
02:14:99
02:13:9902:13:99
02:09:9902:09:99
02:07:99
02:04:9902:04:99
02:01:9902:01:99
01:59:99
01:55:9901:55:99
01:54:99
01:53:99
01:49:9901:49:99
01:46:99
01:45:99
01:44:99
01:43:99
01:39:99
01:37:9901:37:9901:37:99
01:34:99
01:31:99
01:29:9901:29:99
01:28:99
01:25:99
01:24:99
01:21:99
01:19:9901:19:9901:19:99
01:14:99
01:13:9901:13:99
01:10:99
01:09:99
01:07:99
01:05:99
01:04:99
01:01:9901:01:99
00:59:99
00:57:99
00:55:99
00:54:99
00:52:99
00:49:9900:49:9900:49:99
00:44:99
00:43:9900:43:99
00:41:99
00:39:99
00:37:99
00:34:9900:34:99
00:33:99
00:31:99
00:29:99
00:25:9900:25:9900:25:99
00:24:99
00:19:9900:19:99
00:17:99
00:16:99
00:14:99
00:13:99
00:09:9900:09:99
00:07:9900:07:99
00:04:99
00:01:9900:01:99

The 9-second interval guard (#1) is able to spawn once you get about halfway towards the T-junction from the beginning area. His non-elimination radius stretches all the way to Valentin's alley, but only the last part of it, with the windows and GL/BA. For the other guard you need to go a few meters past the T-junction (but not as far as we go with current strats).

Optimally, you'd want the 9 second guard to spawn first, since he spawns further away (to keep them somewhat synchronized). You'd also want the last known position of Bond to not be too far away from where they spawn, or else you'll have to wait too long. Other way around, you don't want them to get there too fast either, in case you can't get the tank in place fast enough (not sure if this is a problem though).

Anyway, i haven't worked out the best way of doing this yet, but i thought i'd post it anyway. Maybe someone will figure out an even better way of doing things that i've overlooked.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2014, 01:54:40 pm by Wyst3r »

Wouter Jansen

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1823 on: October 29, 2014, 02:28:07 pm »
I can successfully do it the way you've shown it in your previous video (that is with placing tank into place and waiting for them to catch up and see me, and then wait for their animations to end). Tons of sub 5s, the only problem I'm having is still the start. That's most of the grind. #4 seems complex to be sure when to leave and feel safe about not meeting any spawns on your way. If you find a reliable and consistent way for it, it will surely save another nice lot of time, and makes tank control easier (though it isn't too bad after some practice anyway)
sexy, this

Wouter Jansen

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1824 on: October 29, 2014, 02:31:14 pm »
Another nice extra is that this strat you only have to pass the window guards once, and you can survive them even if the first doesn't freeze. He will often hit you on the 2nd way passing by on previous strats.
sexy, this

flicker

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1825 on: October 29, 2014, 02:56:32 pm »
Nice finds again Henrik, seeing as I'm the only one currently playing who can really handle the intro with some decency, I might do some playing around with all this now.

He will often hit you on the 2nd way passing by on previous strats.

Not from any lines I was taking ( body armor guard, not GL room )
I actually dont like the GL room guard at all, I've tried freezing him a bit but I'd rather just kill him. With new strat it's really nice, after val, just run out to the middle window and use pp7 at short range to spam headshots really fast.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2014, 03:04:57 pm by entity of light »

Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1826 on: October 29, 2014, 04:28:07 pm »
Turns out cinema doesn't matter for guard timings, so the table above will always be true, no matter what.

Also i made a picture showing roughly the area in which the 5-second interval guard can spawn:



So if the timer hits 4 or 9 while inside this, he'll spawn.

flicker

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1827 on: October 30, 2014, 08:09:22 am »
new route, bad run, still untied.
sub 5 soon.


Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1828 on: October 30, 2014, 10:27:59 am »
That was fast! Great job!

After looking into the new tank strats a bit more, i've realized that it's far more unreliable than i first thought. Those guards are just way too random. So you're probably best off going for the original strat.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2014, 10:50:51 am by Wyst3r »

Wouter Jansen

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1829 on: October 30, 2014, 03:22:11 pm »
we can't give up this easily!
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Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1830 on: October 30, 2014, 03:37:56 pm »
Has this been done before?


I went very slow here obviously. It's possible to have like 1:50-1:40 left on the timer when reaching the tank (at least with the faster version described below). So you can definately reach Val in time if you use old strat. There might be *barely* enough time to use new strat as well, but it'd be very tight.

You can do an even faster version as well:

0. Cut both cinemas.
1. Show yourself to the first guard (the right one)
2. Hide behind the pillar and start shooting headshots once he reaches you.
3. While reloading, show yourself to the second guard, and pray the first doesn't kill you.
4. Kill first guard, and wait for the others to arrive (shoot whoever comes first a few times, since they rarely appear at exactly the same time)
5. Run out and hide on the other side. Then take out both as quickly as you can with the PP7 (similar to the video above, but do it faster :p)

Wouter Jansen

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1831 on: October 30, 2014, 03:52:02 pm »
nice!, did you get the idea from watching my stream last night? :)
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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1832 on: October 30, 2014, 04:27:48 pm »
flicker you fucking beast!
3:35 hitekaimerr: mate my wrist is sprained, cap card broken, and i think i just went blind

3:35 hitekaimerr: cant stream




Icy

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1833 on: October 30, 2014, 05:03:05 pm »
Looks like the new strat is amazing if a bad run beats your god run, lol. Great job, Flicker!

That's so sick, Henrik! Interesting form of AI abuse. Streets DLTK is becoming a complete joke now, lol. :v

Wouter Jansen

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1834 on: October 31, 2014, 02:01:35 pm »
What are the Civilian timers for?
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Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1835 on: October 31, 2014, 02:47:39 pm »
Lol you noticed them? I hadn't had a chance to post about them yet :kappa:

Anyway, I believe the civilians can interfere with the spawning guards, making them more random, so in order to find a consistent strat i need to take them into account. I got pretty consistent results in a modded version where i removed them completely.

I think i have a new strat for you to test Wouter ;) It has been consistent in emulator tests so far:



In a real run, it'd require a 5:26 start to make it in time. So if this works, i probably also need to find a strat for slower paced runs.

Wouter Jansen

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1836 on: October 31, 2014, 05:46:57 pm »
This strat is getting more funny for viewers lol

I might test tonight.

What does the first wait / new 2:23 line do?
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Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1837 on: October 31, 2014, 06:37:18 pm »
Civilian #2 spawns just below Guard #1 so his area reaches all the way to that line. By staying outside it we ensure that he doesn't spawn one cycle too early (although i'm not entirely certain if it matters).

Btw, wait at the tank until 1:33 instead of 1:34, it seems better.

It's a bit problematic that the next cycle of guard spawns both occur at 02:04:99, which means they won't be synchronized at all (because Guard #1 spawns further away). Might still work out though. Even the next spawn after that is just a 1 sec difference. So we'll have to deal with it in either case, since i doubt we want to spend 20+ seconds just waiting.


flicker

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1838 on: October 31, 2014, 07:37:16 pm »
bad start, bad end... FUCK IT

STREETS DARK LTK 4:56


easy...lol

Icy

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1839 on: October 31, 2014, 07:59:36 pm »
Sub 5 is sick! Awesome job!

I think with a run like in your 5:26, Streets DLTK could reach around 4:20-4:30, but of course is mostly luck-based. Great to see another milestone broken for the level!

Wodahs-Reklaw

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1840 on: October 31, 2014, 08:23:34 pm »
Good job, that casual sub 5!
I hope to see sub 4:30 some day  :nesquik:
Daniel Wodahs-Relklaw Coelho

Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1841 on: October 31, 2014, 10:26:54 pm »
Congrats on Sub 5 man! AWESOME JOB :o  :pimp:

AZ

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1842 on: November 01, 2014, 05:52:15 am »
Really nice progress, Kyle! :smokin:

Wouter Jansen

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1843 on: November 01, 2014, 10:03:26 am »
sexy, this

Icy

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1844 on: November 01, 2014, 04:38:19 pm »
Good job, Wouter!

Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1845 on: November 02, 2014, 07:02:12 am »
Another strat for normal paced runs:




Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1846 on: November 02, 2014, 09:11:32 am »
Found a good way of killing all 3 guards in the beginning of Val's alley with 2 tank shots very consistently. Also the strategy described above seems to work extremely well, it hasn't failed a single time in 1,5h of console attempts and a ton of emulator attempts. I think it's important to have good execution of this strat though, so i decided to make a video showing off exactly how i do it:


Make sure to copy everything exactly and it should work every time.

flicker

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1847 on: November 02, 2014, 09:26:36 am »
Great, the alley is a bit of a rough spot sometimes. So the first shot kills the furthest guard first, the one on the right walks into the explosion. Yeah this is actually extremely helpful.

Wyst3r

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1848 on: November 02, 2014, 10:00:08 am »
I think it's the other way around, the explosion kills the closest guard, and the furthest sees it and runs into explosion.

flicker

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Re: Post new Dark LTK Strats, PRs, and WRs here.
« Reply #1849 on: November 02, 2014, 10:05:40 am »
Hmm, now listening closer to their death noises I think you're right. Even better. Really easy for me to misjudge where the middle guard is placed around that corner.